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Post by Shehrazad on Jul 19, 2009 18:00:37 GMT 1
"You will only have to face them. You can leave when you wish. But you cannot return until you are done.
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Post by Corinna Cannstein on Jul 19, 2009 18:02:00 GMT 1
Cloud-Dancer waited until Owl had finished his speech. She was now bristling with silent anger. She hadn't heard the full extent of his crimes, but Owl's words already made it clear he was guilty of nothing less than cold blooded murder.
"And his punishment?" Cloud-Dancer asked, staring at Danny. "We accept that our actions have consequences. We hunt down and kill the most noble of heroes when they fall. Do you suggest we let a murderer walk free, with no repercussions? We have laws; we are still Garou. Even in the wastelands of the Weaver, we must uphold them. He must pay for what he has done."
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Post by Danny on Jul 19, 2009 20:31:49 GMT 1
(Long post, thought I'd get the elders' argument out of the way in post, since the Cliath will not interrupt. And thanks to minion for helping.)
Danny shook his head calmly. "He will have to face all the surviving victims of his crimes, all their families, and somehow atone for his choices. He will have to forget his entire life, and cut any connection with his past. There is no doubt he is truly repentant, the cleansing stands as proof. Is this not enough?"
"Enough?" Cloud-Dancer asked incredulously. "Enough for a rapist and a murderer? He will be cleansed of his past and his sins. He is practically walking free without the burden of his crimes. Why don't you ask his victims if that is enough. Have you really grown that soft?"
"I have grown to see a great deal. Rape, cruelty, murder, torture: it is a great deal to forgive for even one such act, more so for so many. I accept it is hard to believe that anyone could go so far and still seek redemption." He paused and looked at Tristain. "But he has sought redemption, and I have chosen to spare his life so he can atone for his misdeeds. When he succeeds he will be given a new life, where he will not make the same mistakes again, or you can hold me responsible if he does. Judgement-from-the-Skies has made that clear."
He paused uncertainly. "Perhaps you are right. His crimes are horrific, their effects widespread, the victims - dead or alive - will be tormented by the end they faced. But though atonement will never heal the scars left on others, how will punishment do more?"
A growl started to form in the back of her throat as Cloud-Dancer heard Danny list the crimes. "These are scars we can never heal. We can only prevent them. Punishment is about teaching a lesson, that crimes can never just be forgiven, that even if mercy is offered for crimes of such a magnitude, it must always come at a price. It will not give anyone satisfaction to enforce this punishment. But it is our duty, just the same."
Danny sighed and shook his head. "Perhaps I have grown soft. He commited his crimes because he was directed by others, so I offer mercy, but he still failed to choose the alternatives. Many have chosen to face death or torture before allowing themselves to do these things."
"To be merciful is important, but it is also important to be just. He may not be totally at fault, but that defence only lessens his crimes, it does not eradicate them. Punishment must be dealt in equal measure..." He looked around at the gathered Garou. "Judgement-from-the-Skies demanded his death, and I have refused. Silent-Hunter also agreed with that judgement, placing both Philodox of this Sept against me. Elpis' Ardour merely suggested his manhood be sacrificed. I am no judge, what do you suggest?"
"Letting others lead him into crime does nothing to lessen them," Cloud-Dancer countered angrily. "Even if he were blind, deaf and dumb, he still knows it is wrong." She shook her head, almost unable to believe what she was hearing. "How can you make excuses after everything you and your allies have faced in this city to keep from falling to the Wyrm." She paused and turned to glance at Yvonne, and raised eyebrows her at the suggestion. There was something else there too, but it was hard to make out. "We will show him mercy. He will not be put to death. Owl has decided, and I will not go against his wisdom. But he has spilt blood, so his shall be spilt. For the suffering he has caused, he will also suffer. And for the choice he has taken from others, so will his be taken from him."
Danny's anger, though still controlled, was readily apparent. "A child can be taught to kill and be taught to believe it is just. His first change tore him from humanity and thrust him into the life of Garou, and only had the guidance of the Black Spiral Dancers to show him the ways of our kind. He went against his conscience only at their urgings. I know myself how persuasive they can be, I can not say what I would of done if I had not known better myself." He shook his head. "But to be taught to murder is one thing, to be taught to be cruel is quite another. He will not be be put to death, as I have decided." He gave the Adren a stern look with the emphasis. "But I do not know if I can decide a punishment."
"He is not a child," Cloud-Dancer almost snarled, but it wasn't a proper snarl. He still held rank above her. "By all standards, he is an adult." Her jaw was set in determination, but she was almost shaking with anger. "Fine then, Silent Strider. If you will shirk your duty, then I will choose for you. It would not be the first time I agree with the strict justice of the Black Furies. Let her do it." She stopped. Deep down, she understood why he needed to believe in redemption. But she didn't share his optimism. "But remember the last time we let our decisions be swayed by our feelings. Remember what we lost," she said.
Danny was momentarily taken aback, then he growled. But finally, he accepted with a weary resignation. "So be it." He looked back at Yvonne, doubtful that she would accept the responsibility and probably hoping she wouldn't. "Elpis' Ardour, the punishment has been chosen. Will you follow your mother's path and carry it out?"
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Tristain
Cub
"Monsters are as Monsters do. Am I a Monster?"
Posts: 170
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Post by Tristain on Jul 19, 2009 22:51:11 GMT 1
"You were right." Tristain is almost surprised to hear his own voice, but he knows what he's saying now. "This isn't redemption." They aren't the right words, but the words don't matter any more. They would never listen to his words, never understand how he cannot accept what they have decided. Likely, they'd never care.
In an instant he's running, dropping to all fours. He knows he can't escape, but he has to try. Odd, really, that actions guided by fear are called bravery and those guided by conviction are going to be called cowardice.
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Kasiya
Cliath
Treads the Darkest Path
Woof.
Posts: 598
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Post by Kasiya on Jul 19, 2009 23:22:14 GMT 1
(Before he notices Tristain leg it, which would be pretty much immediately since he's on his heel:)
A feeling of wrongness had begun to creep into Kasiya as he heard his betters argue. He had better sense to butt in, but as Danny and Cloud Dancer came to their conclusion he felt he had to say something.
"No. This is wrong. I have another way."
The idea forms itself in his head entirely in an instant he does have a better way. One that won't give the poor cub a maiming that he'd have for the rest of his life to remind him that rape and murder had been the easier option. He just needs to get them to listen.
((If Tristain wants to reconsider pegging it there's at least one Garou present who doesn't want to lop his todger off.))
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Post by Corinna Cannstein on Jul 19, 2009 23:37:26 GMT 1
Cloud-Dancer was quick to shift to Crinos and block Tristain's escape. Speaking in Crinos was not easy, and she half-spoke, half-growled out the words. "Close the circle," she ordered the two Cliath and the Fostern.
"You chose to face judgement. If facing lenient punishment for your crimes makes you go back on your word and flee from your chance at atonement, then you are not truly ready to atone... accept it, or die for your unrepented crimes. It doesn't even come close to the suffering of your victims."
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Yvonne
Cliath
Elpis' Ardour
Posts: 528
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Post by Yvonne on Jul 19, 2009 23:43:56 GMT 1
Yvonne keeps her eyes low while Danny and Cloud-Dancer argue the matter. She looks up in suprise, not having expected her suggestion to have any weight, and looks down again sharply as Danny offers the 'honour' to her. "I... you want me to do it?" The idea upsets her, not because she sees anything wrong with it or because cutting meat bothers her, just because she's never harmed anyone outside the heat of battle.
The whole matter becomes moot as Tristain bails. He'd been given such a generous judgement that would leave the cruel murderer with a mere maiming that he'd have for the rest of his life to remind him that rape and murder had been the easy option and he'd been too weak to choose honour and decency over serving his own selfish needs.
Yvonne doesn't hesitate to also shift to Crinos at Cloud-Dancer's instruction and close in behind him. Tristain didn't seem like he was going to accept any sort of punishment for his monstrous acts, as he shows no conviction to his claims of repentance, and is only continuing to sicken her for the trust and mercy she had shown before.
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Kasiya
Cliath
Treads the Darkest Path
Woof.
Posts: 598
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Post by Kasiya on Jul 20, 2009 0:06:35 GMT 1
'Though he might feel mutilation the wrong punishment and disagree with the Fenrir's uncompromising methods, Kasiya doesn't disobey his elders.
He closes his part of the circle, but doesn't yet shift form. He's most comfortable as a Wolf, and remains so.
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Post by Danny on Jul 20, 2009 0:27:18 GMT 1
Micah shifted to Crinos too and followed Cloud-Dancer's instructions. He stood at her right, but glanced up to see what Danny would do before he attacked.
"How far do you think you can run?" Danny asked. He hadn't changed forms, or even moved. "Even if we let you, how long before they catch up with you? Is this really the better option?"
He stepped into the circle which the others had formed. He glanced curiously at his tribe-mate, but as much as wanted to hear it, it would have to wait just a little longer. "This is how the world works. Crimes are punished, just as in the human world. Those who can't accept that either live outside of society, or attempt to change it. If you choose to live, you will find that is what those of your auspice do. If you choose to run, then this will be the last time I will stand between you and my allies' claws."
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Tristain
Cub
"Monsters are as Monsters do. Am I a Monster?"
Posts: 170
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Post by Tristain on Jul 20, 2009 7:01:29 GMT 1
Tristain pulls round as he is cut off with a snarl, then shifts to homid to speak, looking at Danny. "All you've just proved is I can't look to any of you for guidance." His words are low, sad. "I guess I can't stop you doing what you want." He shakes his head sadly. He'd wanted them to be better than this, to be something he might aspire to being. But using words to excuse these actions, that was where his last path had started.
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Post by Corinna Cannstein on Jul 20, 2009 7:11:14 GMT 1
Cloud-Dancer snarled when Danny stepped between them and once again when Tristain spoke.
"Pretty self-righteous for a convicted rapist and murderer," she said. "Did you think there would be no consequences for your actions?"
She turned to Danny. "What more proof do you want that he will run the first chance he gets?"
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Post by Danny on Jul 20, 2009 7:24:39 GMT 1
"I knew he would," Danny said sadly. "I hoped with time he would understand why we don't."
He stepped aside, giving Tristain a way out of the circle. There was nothing more he could say. Everything had he said under the Ash tree seemed to have fallen on deaf ears. For all his talk about choice and responsibility, Tristain was still looking for someone to tell him what to do.
"We all choose our heroes," he said. "We choose who we want to aspire to be." He pointed to the gap in the circle. "You can make your choice," he said. "I won't stand in your way anymore."
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Tristain
Cub
"Monsters are as Monsters do. Am I a Monster?"
Posts: 170
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Post by Tristain on Jul 20, 2009 8:17:46 GMT 1
Tristain looks warily at the way out, then at the other Garou. He doesn't immediately run, but that may well be because of several Crinos forms around him poised to run him down, whatever Danny just said.
"I'm not running from what I need to do. But justifying shit like that was where it all started."
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Post by Corinna Cannstein on Jul 20, 2009 8:41:54 GMT 1
"And now you are twisting words to justify getting out of a deserved punishment," Cloud-Dancer snarled. She was tired of this talk. She wanted him to either take his punishment or run so she could kill him. Either way was fine with her. She was downright furious now. "We have shown you mercy, and you have thrown it back in our face. You have hurt others, but you claim your conviction stops you from taking your punishment for it. If you had pleaded for mercy like a coward, I might have reconsidered. But this twisted hypocrisy is only making you sound more and more like a Spiral."
She waited for him to run before she attacked, but there was no doubt that none of them expected him to get far if he did.
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Post by Danny on Jul 20, 2009 8:48:05 GMT 1
For once, Danny had nothing more to say. Many Garou might not like it, but this was the law of society. He watched Tristain sadly. He had never given up on a cub before, and he couldn't help feeling that he had, somehow, failed.
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